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The 100 Roundtable for Ep. 304, “Watch The Thrones”

This week’s roundtable discussion regarding The 100’s latest episode, “Watch the Thrones,” includes opinions and commentary by Talk Nerdy With Us writers Erica Schaaf, McKenzie Morrell, Jenni Bradley, and a few brief remarks from Nicola Choi when she was able to join in.

IGN and Variety, as well as many viewers, have been speaking up today about their concerns regarding last night’s episode. Are you surprised by the negativity in regards to the episode? What kind of a reaction did you have and what kind of a reaction did you anticipate from the fans?

McKenzie Morrell: I was a little surprised to see that bigger outlets were voicing their issues with the episode, but I can’t say that I completely disagree with them. I think that since we’re going full speed ahead now that things are bound to fall through the cracks and notable plot holes will come to the forefront. I had a high-energy, ‘holy shit this is great,’ reaction to the episode and I expected the fans to feel similarly. I think that they still felt that– there’s just that idea that maybe we should be picking things apart a little more now that things are getting down to the wire.

Erica Schaaf: I know when I first saw it, I was all excited and hyped, but watching it this time and seeing the criticisms, I could completely understand where they were coming from and it made me take another look and kind of go, ‘Hmm…this could have been developed better.’ Honestly, the biggest thing that thought made me wish was for a slightly longer season. Even 2-4 more episodes could have shored up some of the plot holes.

McKenzie Morrell: Yes, even though the order that they got is pretty big for this show (I couldn’t imagine having to write a 24 episode season and not go a little insane) but an even 20 eps would have done just nicely. That way we could have seen more of the Ice Queen/Lexa interaction, the coup being drawn out a little more and Bellamy’s knee-jerk reaction to newcomer Pike. We needed more investment, not to say I’m not whole-heartedly already invested but re: Gina, Ice Queen, Pike, it could have used some more marinating!

Erica Schaaf: And the election! I know they said on Twitter that they’d considered an election episode. I don’t think a full episode was needed, but more build-up could have definitely improved audience reaction to the outcome, given the understanding of how and why it happened.

McKenzie Morrell: Yeah, like were the Sky people really wavering that much? Did they really not see the benefit in becoming the 13th clan? Is Pike a better alternative to Abby or Kane… questions left unanswered, but could have been great to explore.

Erica Schaaf: Well, and things that left me going, “Huh?” were things like, “Why didn’t Kane and Abby tell the Arkers about becoming the 13th clan and what that meant?” and “Why didn’t they let everyone know about the army being put together for their protection?” I mean, the fastest way to have a panic is to NOT tell people what’s going on.

McKenzie Morrell: I mean things happened pretty quickly. There might not have been time to sit down and tell them that– considering Mt. Weather just went up in flames. Memorial happening… people were surely on edge.

Jenni Bradley: I’m extremely disappointed in the election. I expected it to be drawn out more, not over in the span of a minute. I understand the reason for making Pike chancellor is to create another antagonist, but it felt rushed.

Erica Schaaf: I did feel like a lot was rushed. One thing that really disappointed me overall was what was written for Clarke’s character. It felt…pointless? I wasn’t expecting to feel like the main was being sidelined but that’s exactly how I felt.

Jenni Bradley: And maybe if more Arkadians had been given the chance to walk around and explore Polis, they might have seen the benefits to becoming the 13th tribe. But instead, only the top dogs were allowed to go. So is it any wonder that the majority went with Pike? Also, what was the point of Clarke changing Lexa’s bandage? It had obviously been attended to and looked clean, so it seems the only reason was for there to be a sexually charged moment.

Erica Schaaf: Exactly. The time used for that scene could have gone to SOMETHING that would have given us a view of the election or Kane and Abby’s reaction to everything. What were your thoughts, though, about Clarke’s interaction with Roan, her second failed attempt at being an assassin, her rapid change of heart toward Lexa? I think that could have used to have been developed more as well…

Jenni Bradley: At this point Clarke has waffled so much on Lexa that I’m beginning to get whiplash. I’m still mostly undecided on Roan.

McKenzie Morrell: Ha. Reading your responses in regards to Lexa’s bandage changing is comical.

Jenni Bradley: Clarke should definitely leave the assassin-ing to the professionals, since she either chickens out or is too obvious.

McKenzie Morrell: I agree that there was no need to change the dressing, the new one looked dirtier than before– but I guess it offered a moment for them to “bond” or find some common ground and talk about forgiving people who make bad choices.

Erica Schaaf: Did they talk about that?

McKenzie Morrell: She asked her how she moves forward after being betrayed by her ambassadors… we see where that was going.

Erica Schaaf: I didn’t see that as forgiving people who make bad choices. I saw that as there still being a pretty huge threat to Lexa out there. I mean, Nia was only one person. The other clans could easily band together and take Lexa out.

McKenzie Morrell: I don’t think the clans are that predictable. Not to mention Nia seemed to be the one antagonizing. Not to say that Ontari doesn’t still have her own agenda being under the Ice Queen’s guidance for so long. But as for another coup by the clans– doubtful.

Jenni Bradley: The death of the Ice Queen and rise of the Ice King was a twist I didn’t see coming. I find this show is moderately predictable but this was unexpected. Unless it was talked about previously and I just completely missed it.

McKenzie Morrell: There was a moment when Clarke told Roan she wanted him to become the King. Watching it now after seeing the screeners, I’m like, ‘Damn, it was there all along. Was this planned? Did he know Lexa was going to kill Nia?’

Erica Schaaf: I did think that was possible. Yeah.

McKenzie Morrell: Just to add to that forgiveness plot before we move on, I think it mirrored Clarke’s own struggle with Lexa. Like, how is she supposed to forgive and move forward and work with her after she did such an awful thing. And Lexa’s response of ‘hey, people do what they think is right at the time, it doesn’t make them bad people… just bad choices.’

Jenni Bradley: Was Nia supposed to be hardcore? Because I found her extremely dull.

Erica Schaaf: Really? I wanted to see more of her. I thought she was gone too soon.

McKenzie Morrell: She could have used some more screen time, so that we really get into those layers.

Jenni Bradley: Well I also find Roan dull, so maybe it’s just me.

Erica Schaaf: I really like Roan. He’s subtle. And watchful.

McKenzie Morrell: I dig Roan. I’m looking forward to seeing where his newfound title takes him. And what it means for Lexa…

Erica Schaaf: Definitely.

Jenni Bradley: I feel like Lexa making him King will be her undoing. Not that he would try to usurp her as Uber Commander, but that her followers will see it as continued weakness.

Erica Schaaf: Really? How?

McKenzie Morrell: She skewered the Ice Queen… I don’t think anyone saw that as weakness. Roan is just someone who actually will work with the coalition, vs. try to unravel it. Anyone who really cares about their people and their clans coming together will see that.

Jenni Bradley: Her many ambassadors have already been questioning her, including Titus. The coronation could be setting up for another, larger coup.

McKenzie Morrell: Eh. Not sure I think that’s where this story is going… but, everyone is entitled to speculate where things are heading.

Erica Schaaf: I don’t know. It may not come as another coup attempt. I think it may come as Ontari going in as an assassin. And I’m betting she’d be far more effective at killing people on an individual level than Clarke. What did you think of the scene at the Dropship with Monty and Jasper?

McKenzie Morrell: PAINFUL. It was like watching Rachel and Ross break up for good. These two have been through so much, and to see it come to a peak, was just earth-shattering. Mad props to Christopher Larkin and Devon Bostick, they really wowed me.

Jenni Bradley: JASPER! My little broken man! As someone who has been dealing with depression (but not necessarily tragic lost loves), I can understand what he’s going through. I just hope Monty doesn’t give up on him while Jasper tried to push him away.

McKenzie Morrell: JONTY will rise.

Erica Schaaf: I loved the scene and their acting. They both blew me away. What I had a hard time understanding was the reason for Finn’s ashes to have been involved…

McKenzie Morrell: Oh please let me explain this!

Jenni Bradley: Was it just Finn’s? I assumed it was everyone’s. Maybe not ALL of the ashes, but a bit from everyone who has died.

Erica Schaaf: Remember when Abby tried to give Clarke his ashes? That’s what I ended up thinking it was. So just his as far as I know. I originally thought they were Maya’s somehow.

McKenzie Morrell: I saw it as Jasper took Finn’s ashes to get back at Clarke. Wanheda took the love of his life, and he would do the same. Clearly Abby was saving them for her for when she returned, how heartbroken would she have been if she came back to find out Jasper dumped him somewhere and she didn’t have a chance to say goodbye. Monty had that reaction because he knew what that would mean to Clarke. That’s how I saw it anyways.

Jenni Bradley: Based on Monty’s reaction, I first assumed they were Maya’s. But after Finn’s name was mentioned I thought it was everyone. Nice to see the different interpretations!

McKenzie Morrell: Super interesting to hear different interpretations

Erica Schaaf: It just feels like it’s been so long since Finn’s death and Clarke is clearly appearing to have moved on and doesn’t seem to be thinking of Finn at all. I had much more of a heartfelt reaction to Monty mentioning Raven’s response to Jasper stealing the ashes.

McKenzie Morrell: Eh. I don’t think that Clarke has completely moved on. I think that’s the first thing that really haunted her since her time on the ground. Yeah, maybe a little bit of both then. Who knows!

Erica Schaaf: I’ve seen a lot of people saying a number of different things as to the reason WHY Bellamy decided to follow Pike. Things from him being out of character to the writers trying to put him on a level playing field with Lexa as far as decisions to allow people to die are concerned to the possibility that he’s supposed to parallel Clarke’s decisions last season (except that there wasn’t the buildup to allow the emotional impact and that he wasn’t really forced into the decision he’s making). What do you think of all that? And how do you see it?

Jenni Bradley: I find it very out of character. If anything, he should’ve fought against Pike. They started the season with him trying everything in his power to find and save Clarke, so why would he jeopardize it by allowing a Grounder-phobe to gain power? The end result would be Pike destroying Polis and possibly killing Clarke, even if it was accidental.

McKenzie Morrell: I see it as the tip of the iceberg, an iceberg we really didn’t get to see in its magnitude. But an Iceberg nonetheless. It wasn’t just about Gina’s death (who we barely knew) or the Farm Station people (who we barely knew) but it was more about Bellamy’s internal battle and him feeling like he failed. He puts a lot of pressure on himself to save everyone, and when he can’t that’s when everything comes flooding him. Siding with Pike has given him a different outlet and one that he can control and perhaps get some justice for everything and everyone he’s lost on the ground. I don’t think it was out of character at all– he’s an evolution of his former self and the idea that he’s trying to get on a level playing field with Lexa is kind of outrageous. Sure, let’s murder 300 people so I can win the girl. No. I think Pike is definitely on a mission to destroy all the grounders and the truce that’s been forged with Lexa’s coalition, and I hope for Bellamy’s sake he gets back on the right damn side.

Erica Schaaf: That idea wasn’t from an in character perspective, it was stated by some as from the writers’ perspective, in regards to evening the playing field.

McKenzie Morrell: Even so, I don’t think that’s a smart place to come from.

Erica Schaaf: For me, I did have to wonder if it was an intentional decision to have Monty not there to try to reason with Bellamy when he was making that decision. I mean, we saw the two of them really being there for each other in the first two episodes, supporting each other. And yet in this critical moment, Monty was gone.

McKenzie Morrell: Yeah, I mean, perhaps he could have talked him out of it.

Jenni Bradley: And now that makes me think there’s a conspiracy. Jasper was so adamant that Monty go with him. Maybe because he knew which way Bellamy would fall without him? Jasper has more reason than anyone to hate the Grounders. I could see him doing whatever necessary to break the alliance.

Erica Schaaf: Mmm…I don’t know that there’s a conspiracy…but that’s an interesting thought.

McKenzie Morrell: Agreed, Erica.

Erica Schaaf: What was the high point of this week’s episode for you?

McKenzie Morrell: Hmmm… high point. Let me think.

Jenni Bradley: It’s sad, but the high point was no scenes with Jaha.

Erica Schaaf: (LOL)

McKenzie Morrell: Unfortunately we might see him again next week

Erica Schaaf: I kind of like that Jaha feels a bit like the bad guy right now.

McKenzie Morrell: I’m not sure he’s the bad guy, I would say Pike is…but Jaha is just batshit… making decisions for people without their consent.

Erica Schaaf: “Maybe there are no bad guys.” (laughs)

Jenni Bradley: Jaha is major crazy town.

Erica Schaaf: He definitely was without enough oxygen for far too long.

Jenni Bradley: Ok maybe not. The high point? Monty and Jasper at the drop ship.

McKenzie Morrell: High point was finally getting to see Lexa assert her authority in a physical manner. And I’m not talking about CLEXA. ha. We’ve never seen her fight before, everyone was just always taking orders from her– so it’s nice to see she actually can hold her own.

Nicola Choi: Probably the excellent choreography in the fight scene, Nia’s death (!!!), and Clarke trying to poison her. But yeah, Lexa being a commander in her own right was great. Her line about not letting anyone fight for her because she’s the commander was awesome. Hi guys, by the way, I’m a bit busy at the moment but wanted to join in.

Erica Schaaf: I think the high point for me was the choreography of the fight. I’m not sure how realistic it was that Lexa won when we’d seen what Clarke saw from Roan’s fighting skills, but it was definitely a seriously sexy scene just from an aesthetically pleasing point of view.

Nicola Choi: Regarding the realistic-ness of the fight – Lexa’s style was Kali, I think, confirmed by Aaron Ginsburg. It’s a Filipino martial art that is very intricate. You train in hand to hand combat as well as multiple weapons. Lexa’s speed and agility won her the fight as did Roan’s cockiness – he was too slow in killing Lexa. He raised his spear when he should have just shoved it in her throat. Most of Kali is about anticipation and quick recovery. Asian martial arts is a good choice for Lexa because of her size (Did you ever see Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon?). Like when Roan presses down on her with the blade, she puts her free hand on the other end of her own. This allows her to manipulate the angle of Roan’s weapon and thus turn a defensive block into an attack – hence decking him in the face.

Erica Schaaf: Interesting. The only martial art I really know anything about is Taekwondo.

Nicola Choi: Yeah, because styles like Wing Chun or Wu Shu fighting (that involve Weaponry) benefit the smaller, agile person. It’s all about exploiting weakness and anticipation, patience, confidence, economy of movement, etc.

Erica Schaaf: That’s seriously cool. Have you guys seen the promotional pictures for next week?

Jenni Bradley: Nope. This is one of those shows that I intentionally stay spoiler free. Every new episode is completely new.

McKenzie Morrell: I just looked at them… but, if we wanna stay spoiler free then I won’t comment.

Erica Schaaf: Nicola, did you see the promotional photos for next week? I’d really like to talk about those. Maybe we can blindfold Jenni. (laughs)

Jenni Bradley: Nah, go for it. I’ll plug my ears.

Nicola Choi: Haha I did!

Erica Schaaf: Soooo…next week…Clarke’s in Arkadia!!! We have Abby/Clarke scenes!!! I’m squealing right now!

McKenzie Morrell: So is Jaha… Alie… and Pike? Also… I think Clarke and Abby are at the drop ship, not Arkadia… seeing as Pike has taken that over, it’ll be hard for them to talk about what’s going on.

Erica Schaaf: Are they? I don’t care! They’re together. I’ll take it!

McKenzie Morrell: I don’t know! Or maybe they’re in some secret wing. Don’t quote me on that. hahaha

Erica Schaaf: Jaha, ALIE, and Pike together scares the crap out of me.

McKenzie Morrell: Maybe Pike sees her, too. Maybe they got him already! And this is some master ALIE plan to drive a wedge between grounders and sky people. dun dun dun

Erica Schaaf: I’m kinda wondering if ALIE makes that whole field of people dying able to happen.

McKenzie Morrell: Hmmmm…. things to ponder for the next week..

Written by Erica Schaaf

Erica is a former social worker and mother of three who has been writing since she was a child. She currently writes fanfiction for the Veronica Mars and The 100 fandoms and is published on Kindle Worlds as well as fanfiction.net and archiveofourown.org. She hopes to one day have the chance to be a fly on the wall on set of her fave shows while filming!

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  1. “Nicola Choi: Regarding the realistic-ness of the fight – Lexa’s style was Kali, I think, confirmed by Aaron Ginsburg. It’s a Filipino martial art that is very intricate. You train in hand to hand combat as well as multiple weapons. Lexa’s speed and agility won her the fight as did Roan’s cockiness – he was too slow in killing Lexa. He raised his spear when he should have just shoved it in her throat. Most of Kali is about anticipation and quick recovery. Asian martial arts is a good choice for Lexa because of her size (Did you ever see Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon?). Like when Roan presses down on her with the blade, she puts her free hand on the other end of her own. This allows her to manipulate the angle of Roan’s weapon and thus turn a defensive block into an attack – hence decking him in the face.
    Erica Schaaf: Interesting. The only martial art I really know anything about is Taekwondo.
    Nicola Choi: Yeah, because styles like Wing Chun or Wu Shu fighting (that involve Weaponry) benefit the smaller, agile person. It’s all about exploiting weakness and anticipation, patience, confidence, economy of movement, etc.”

    Haha. Coolest part of the discussiion for me. THAT’S how you analyze something. People seem to forget that just because Lexa’s small and Roan is so muscular, that Lexa will lose. Lexa’s been training since she was 2 to become a warrior. You don’t think she learnt how to fight like a grandmaster in time? Good to see some real insight into the kali thing the writer Aaron mentioned. If size were a problem in fighting they’d be boxing/grappling and Lexa would use, but in weapon-based fighting and utilizing the enemy’s weakness (like Nia says, Roan is cocky) – Lexa is calm and we see through the whole episode she’s absolutely confident in her fighting skills, and she was right. Thanks for an accurate and brief insight into fighting styles @Nicola Choi, I’m so glad somebody understands that.

    • Typo! I meant in a boxing/grappling situation Lexa would likely “LOSE” not “USE”.

      I’m intrigued to find out more about the kali style of fighting – perhaps a post/article?

      • @Taylor and @Isabela–thank you–I couldn’t type fast enough to gt it all in, but it was very cool that Aaron Ginsburg stated Lexa’s style of fighting was kali style–and i was so happy that they’d thought about it to an extent where they’d really considered Lexa’s stature vs. Roan’s, as well as their personalities. Roan is even implicated by Nia before the fight to not be cocky…indicating he is. Lexa, we know, is stoic and calm under pressure. Thought the trial by combat was excellent finished, though I wished Brenda was in more eps for some Lexa/IQ showdown, but it was both closure to the Costia heartbreak and also–Titus only says the only rule is “one person must day today” … and Lexa adhered to that by killing the IQ! A show of strength to her treacherous ambassadors but also closure, and a fight to the death? Well Lexa certainly killed the person who threw the gauntlet!

        @Taylor re: more on the kali style, Im not sure yet but I can’t take full credit–I had some help with the “Lexa grapples her own sword and manips the angle to turn it into attack” bit — but the point is, kali fighters trained with numerous weapons AND had the ability to do hand-to-hand and improvise with new weapons picked up. They were speedy, agile, intelligent,,,you may find a lot of Asian martial arts have similar principles. For example wing chun it’s not about attack and then defence – its about attack AND defence, simultaneously. Eg. I parry your attack and simultaneously attack you back — does that make sense ? I could go on for days lol because MA is very detailed, but I’m glad you found it interesting, it’s a great passion of mine (and my dad’s!). I wanted to just say that it wasn;t unrealistic that Lexa defeated Roan at all. The size of a warrior is negligible if you fight a certain way, and Lexa definitely did.

  2. Wow, this is sort of a hot mess? It’s very easy to see which of you follow for plot driven story and those interested in character development. How could anyone dismiss the last scene with Clarke and Lexa as unnecessary or fan-service? It revealed a great deal about Clarke as a person and also Lexa. I haven’t seen any other reviewers complain about it. In fact all have raved about Clarke’s story in Polis. Seems it’s the only thing they are happy with. The fight scene was absolutely stunning and some of the best television I’ve ever seen.

    And did it dawn on anyone that maybe Clarke changed that bandage so she could have Lexa’s blood analyzed? This is Clarke Griffin we are talking about? I felt like this was the first time we really saw Clarke this season. Backstabbing? Manipulating? Plotting? Fixing? getting all up in the commanders space? How anyone felt she was being sidelined is beyond me. Clarke is back and working her magic even in Polis. And I’m consistently amazed at how Eliza Taylor has chemistry with just absolutely everyone. Lexa, Roan, Nia, even the small scene with Titus was well done. Kudos to Eliza, she brings out the best in many.

    McKenzie Morrell – Loved what you said about Clarke struggling to forgive Lexa. That was certainly a moment no? And I think while it was obvious Lexa was referring to herself.. reminding Clarke of the mountain and why Lexa made the decision, (I like to call that “the moment Lexa cockblocked herself”) but in that statement she is also offering Clarke a path to forgive herself. She has seen how much Clarke has struggled, and has been there too. She’s not only seeking forgiveness for her actions, but hoping it will allow Clarke to see that she isn’t a monster, and that she can also move forward. Maybe even they can move forward? The whole scene was beautifully done. I think the UST was really just a bonus.

    Would also love to hear more from Nicola Choi – the analysis on Lexa’s fighting skill was fantastic, and something I was curious about and hadn’t read anywhere else!

    • Hello Sonya, sorry you felt that way! I do agree with you on your two main points:

      1.) Clarke’s manipulative skills–she certainly came to her own that episode. Tried to poison the Queen, tried to manipulate Roan, arguing with the Commander, off-screen clearly trying to persuade Titus (when she says the line “has she changed her mind yet”(?)–so I certainly think she had a very active role this week. Clarke has always been the fixer, the healer. Abby says this in season one, and Lexa says it this episode–that she’s driven to fix everything but sometimes she just can’t. So yes, I agree, I thought Clarke was excellent this episode and really excelled in her independent skills of manipulation and strong will.
      2.) I have to say I agree with your agreement with Mckenzie. The scene for me was not just there for romance. It never is, for Clarke and Lexa. Not yet. Clarke’s still struggling to forgive Lexa, as Mckenzie said, and their political talk was massively telling. When Clarke asked how Lexa could ever move forward after the ambassadors betrayed her (hello 2×15 callback), Lexa tells Clarke that “they were doing what they thought was right for their people, too”. For me this scene was hugely political, as well as romantic. Lexa letting her hair down, being vulnerable and armed–for me it wasn’t some kind of “come-on”. It was her, at her core, totally vulnerable…she’d just killed her nemesis. The civil war is still simmering but it’s Lexa’s own “not yet”–killing Nia, for me, was both personal and political. An end of Costia who haunts her, and a beginning of a new chapter, if Lexa will let her heart have it. She wants Clarke to know that she’ll wait, and will back off–just like she did in 2×15–if Clarke refuses. And Clarke doesn’t. When they exchange goodnights in their respective languages, it’s the ultimate sign of their infusion and understanding and openness of cultures, and it was so layered and beautifully done.

      Thanks for the compliment, though, and thank you for that interesting spec on Clarke analysing Lexa’s black blood–as a medic she’s never seen that before! That’s a very new angle I hadn’t heard. Thank you!

  3. Wow, I was hugely disappointed by this panel. I agree that Pike’s horrible “leadership” is to blame for a lot of Bellamy’s actions, because Bellamy isn’t a leader (terrible in season one, got better with Clarke, soldier in season two and Bob even says he’s not a leader and doesn’t want to be) so he follows Pike- bad mistake. But the fact that it’s brushed off as him being hurt (who hasn’t been hurt in this world? Bellamy lost Gina and some of his people so he goes and agrees with Pike to commit a massacre? Lexa loses Costia and her warriors to the wars and…extends an alliance to the queen? Wtf?)

    You can’t just blame Bellamy’s OOC-ness for his upcoming mass-murder, that’s almost like you’re justifying his disgusting actions. That part of the discussion seriously grossed me out.

    High points were well-written, nice from Mckenzie Morrell and Nicola Choi on the Roan and Lexa fight. By far the most interesting tidbit was the knowledge of martial arts from contributor Nicola (I agree with Taylor and Isabela there) and I hope you contribute more or analyze it in a post about it. That was fascinating and I’d love to learn more.

    • Hi Layla, sorry you felt that way about the panel. I do agree that everyone’s lost someone (Indra=250 villagers; Lexa in the pre-coalition wars; and as you say with Costia; Clarke loses Finn)–yet none of them commit mass-murder. The thing is we will have to want and see 3×05 if there are an external factors that could trick us; trailers can be misleading but when Kane asks Bellamy “you killed an army ? sent to PROTECT us?” plus the look of guilt on Bell’s face–I really think they commit it, which is. horrific. For Bellamy’s OOC-ness I don’t think he’s incapable of doing morally grey stuff (like destroying Raven’s radio so he could save himself) but I do wonder just how far they’ll take Bellamy along Pike’s clearly unmoving xenophobia. It concerned be most because Bellamy had liaised with Indra for 3 months to find Clarke…he knows her…yet he turns round this ep, commits treason and follows Pike. It is indeed disturbing, but we do still have 12 episodes to unravel. One must ponder: is mass-murder ever forgivable? In all our history of those who committed mass murders (Mao, Pol Pot, Stalin) can they ever be redeemed? The numbers are obviously much larger than 300–but the principle of murdering 300 grounders knowing they’re there to keep Arkadia safe is willingly committing mass-murder. So I really do ponder that point and you do make some wonderful points too.

      Thank you for commenting, Layla 🙂

  4. Erica Schaaf: I’m kinda wondering if ALIE makes that whole field of people dying able to happen.

    – Is that just a way of excusing Bellamy and Pike? Kane quite clearly asks Bellamy in the trailer if he killed an army sent to protect them. You can see Bellamy’s look of guilt. They did it.

    Erica Schaaf: Exactly. The time used for that scene could have gone to SOMETHING that would have given us a view of the election or Kane and Abby’s reaction to everything. What were your thoughts, though, about Clarke’s interaction with Roan, her second failed attempt at being an assassin, her rapid change of heart toward Lexa? I think that could have used to have been developed more as well…
    Jenni Bradley: At this point Clarke has waffled so much on Lexa that I’m beginning to get whiplash. I’m still mostly undecided on Roan.
    McKenzie Morrell: Ha. Reading your responses in regards to Lexa’s bandage changing is comical.
    Jenni Bradley: Clarke should definitely leave the assassin-ing to the professionals, since she either chickens out or is too obvious.
    McKenzie Morrell: I agree that there was no need to change the dressing, the new one looked dirtier than before– but I guess it offered a moment for them to “bond” or find some common ground and talk about forgiving people who make bad choices.
    Erica Schaaf: Did they talk about that?

    – Did you watch the episode?

    Jenni Bradley: I find it very out of character. If anything, he should’ve fought against Pike. They started the season with him trying everything in his power to find and save Clarke, so why would he jeopardize it by allowing a Grounder-phobe to gain power? The end result would be Pike destroying Polis and possibly killing Clarke, even if it was accidental.

    – Agreed, and then Bellamy committed treason to get the guns and allow Pike to massacre the Grounders despite Kane’s insistence on Indra’s words AND they’d been working together (Kane, Indra and Bellamy) to find Clarke for months. Bellamy knows the ice Nation are responsible for MW. He was there when IN took responsibility at the ceremony in Polis.

    @McKenzie Morrell – love your comments, very insightful and you clearly watched the episode with an understanding of the plot and the atrocities and consequences.
    @Nicola Choi – I would love to hear more from you. I read your article on The 100 about ethics, war and peace and it was intelligent, articulate and very, very impartial and insightful, as was your dissection of Lexa and Roan’s fight.

  5. This panel is ridiculous. Discussion panels are fun but it’s so heavily biased towards ‘poor Bellamy’ that it’s kind of making me feel nauseous. I love Bellamy. He’s one of my favorite characters. I can’t deny that his turn from season two has been shocking, but everyone on the ground has lost someone. Finn thought he’d lost Clarke so he killed 18 grounders. Abby’s ‘lost’ her daughter several times. Miller was separated from his boyfriend. None of them decided to slaughter 300 innocent grounders.
    Great insight on the fight, by the way, it’s nice to see someone with some martial arts knowledge.
    I don’t ship anyone on the show but the Clarke/Lexa scene was not a waste of time. It was two leaders talking about how to move forwards following a betrayal, and respecting each other’s cultures when they said goodnight. It’s called relationship development.

    • Sorry you felt that way Rohan. I adore Bellamy too (and Bob’s portrayal of him) but his 360 was indeed shocking. You are very right when you say that everyone has lost so many people to the ground–but people deal w/loss differently, and Bellamy seemingly wears his heart on his sleeve. Despite this, if he does partake in the massacre I’m not sure any redemption arc or later actions can justify a xenophobic massacre. And I really wish that this story didn’t fall on Bellamy, because he was exceptional in S2–heroic, brave, noble, kind…and under leadership from Clarke and sometimes Raven. As Bob Morley says he’s an enforcer not a leader. So led by Pike=disaster. It’s nice to see a non shipper POV because it becomes impartial then and lacking of immature “shipping wars”,, and even though I love Clarke & Lexa I love most the characters on the show too–so impartiality is very important IMO. Thanks for commenting Rohan 🙂

  6. To Layla F (I dont know if my message got through because when i replied to you it said “reply to Mary-ann F”

    I completely agree.I totally agree with Mckenzie Morell when she says it was rushed- Brenda Strong was killed in one episode when it could’ve given us some amazing Nia/Lexa interaction, and could you imagine the acting talent of Alycia Debnam-Carey and Brenda Strong in a scene together?

    I also can’t believe that of all the promo’s we got of next week we focus on Arkadia, Abby etc…when there’s a genocide about to happen. Everyone’s lost people on the ground. EVERYONE. Even Lexa, who was an inhabitant anyway, lost multiple people and she didn’t go about angsting and mass murdering innocent people in revenge. Instead she made an alliance with her first love’s murderer. In a show that’s all about perspective shifting, the insane willingness of having to defend every Arker’s actions because they’re the “favorite” characters is ridiculous. The critics loathed the Bellamy/Pike storyline and critically acclaimed the Polis one – look at Variety, AV Club, and IGN, etc. I also completely agree with Sonya’s post.

    I’d also love to hear more from “Nicola Choi” who we haven’t seen much of in regards to Lexa’s fighting style. For a site that’s supposed to include some original content, an indepth analysis of that fight would be amazing considering your show of knowledge in that area,

    @Mckenzie Morrell: “Just to add to that forgiveness plot before we move on, I think it mirrored Clarke’s own struggle with Lexa. Like, how is she supposed to forgive and move forward and work with her after she did such an awful thing. And Lexa’s response of ‘hey, people do what they think is right at the time, it doesn’t make them bad people… just bad choices.’” Exactly.

    If people took their shipper goggles off with this show and watched it for its plot, ethics and morality (as well as romance, I’m not denying that) then the criticisms and discussions would be a lot more intellectual than this.

  7. Tejal, I’m having the same problem. It says I’m replying to “Andrea” when I’m actually replying to “Nicola Choi” – site glitch?

    In response to Nicola Choi’s comment on mine:

    Honestly Nicola Choi I didn’t find your (limited) contribution problematic at all–it was all the sympathizing with Bellamy I found problematic when he’s about to commit genocide. It’s so biased–if you took it from an unbiased point of view and said: “A terrorist is about to commit genocide on 300 innocent people. He’s lost lives and it’s affected him so much. He is really sad and he’s suffered so much.” would you really sympathize with a murderer like that? The amount of Bellamy bias was just horrible in this panel, and I’m saying this as an actual Bellamy fan- I love his character, but I won’t forgive mass-murder. The OOC argument is just stupid because viewers may find it OOC but ultimately, it’s the writers’ storyline- they’re in charge of the characters- and Bellamy COMMITS GENOCIDE.

    Thank you for replying though, Nicola Choi, I really appreciate it, but you’re not to blame for the atrocity of this panel and its clear bias towards Bellamy. Though I do agree with some posters – would you consider a full analysis of the Roan/Lexa fight? You seem educated in history and its wars, as well as martial arts – it’d be nice to get some original content on TNWU.

  8. To Nicola Choi: I admire your peacekeeping (even though Pike may not) and your viewpoints are lovely and impartial to read. However I feel like the problem everyone had with this roundtable discussion was definitely not yours to blame (or Mckenzie Morrell’s). It was the sympathy for someone about to participate in a massacre. The OOC argument is stupidly weak. Note how the actual problematic commentors of that have stayed quiet. There’s no justification for a mass murder, despite Bellamy clearly being their favorite character. I love Bellamy too, but as a POC myself I have been subject to abuse and discrimination before. To see Bellamy actively take part in it is horrible and such a disgusting role-reversal of the great character he was in season two. Like everyone’s said, everyone – literally everyone – has lost masses of people on the ground, and their partners (Clarke and Finn, Lexa and Costia, Raven and Finn, briefly Octavia and Atom) so this is absolutely no excuse.

  9. Bellamy’s storyline is confusing? There was a hard line drawn to the far right wing politics of the States. Something that is very difficult to empathize with right now unless you are a Donald (Pike) Trump supporter. I think perhaps the writers intended to knock Bellamy down a peg or 2 since many of his fans believed he was incapable of such an atrocity. The denial and justification proves that very well may be the case.

    Will be hard to take these round table discussions seriously moving forward. Shame because it was a good idea. When such an obvious bias exists towards the purity of Bellamy and awfulness of Lexa, as a character and her role within the story, then it’s hard to understand how these people are writing professionally for a legitimate news website.

  10. I agree with the above poster Alex. Bellamy’s storyline isn’t just confusing, it’s downright stupid. The thing this isn’t completely OOC, as most of the roundtable Bellamy stans seem to be claiming. He threw Raven’s radio, the only way to contact the Ark, into the river because he was selfish and didn’t want to risk being caught and punished if the Ark landed. He’s always been selfish. He only pulled the lever with Clarke because he saw Octavia in danger. He’ll likely feel remorse next episode but if it’s after Octavia beats him up (as seen in the season 3 trailer) and says “you’re dead to me” then again, it’s selfish. He only cares about his sister. The 44 he cares about but nothing like his sister. He’s not a leader.

    I agree with the bias, too. Clearly the entire roundtable love Bellamy despite him being a genocidal teen and despise Lexa who, in the face of losing her first love (like Bellamy lost Gina) and losing lives in the war, makes a coalition and dearly loves her people. Her heart beats so strongly for her people and for Clarke too. I’d disagree with Alex and say not all of the roundtable discussion contributors were bad (examples McKenzie Morrell and Nicola Choi) but the rest were just biased. Its hard to believe that this is for a news website when such bias is displayed. It’s like watching immature ship wars unravel on Tumblr.

  11. I’m sorry, but is there a reason why the biased, problematic commentators of this roundtable are staying quiet? I understand Nicola Choi is trying to maintain some semblence of peace but to be honest, Nicola Choi, the 3 comments you made were probably the most informative and intelligent ones. The rest were absolutely biased, opinionated and justification of an oncoming slaughter. So to be honest, Nicola Choi you shouldn’t have to defend that. Leave it for the problematic commentators on this roundtable to handle that because their comments were disgraceful, and no, I’m not a shipper, but even I could see that the Clarke/Lexa scene, while set up to be very romantic and showed us progression in their relationship, spoke layers about betrayal and forgiveness. It wasn’t a waste of time.

    I’d love to hear more about the kali fighting stlye though. That’d be an excellent analysis post.

  12. I have to agree with others and say it is really sad when people who have voice in this fandom (here and elsewhere) can’t take their shipper goggles to analyze the show so they keep trying to find excuses to justify actions of certain characters and demonize others. It is so immature and childish. Some people are so lost in their desires of what the show should be that they forget to see how the show is actually being written.

    This idea that Clarke has been sidelined in her own story is absolutely ridiculous. Just because she is the main character doesn’t mean she has to be the central focus in all episodes/scenes. Even in this episode all things related to Lexa are seen through Clarke’s eyes. The scene with the nightbloods only starts when Clarke enters the room. Clarke is the one who finds out Roan is willing to get his mother killed (I’m guessing Clarke told Lexa that), Clarke is the one who finds out about Ontari being a nightblood, she is being active and trying to keep Lexa alive (which she is doing for both her people and herself). But Clarke cannot do everything and save everyone, she has her limits and Lexa, being the great character that she is, can defend herself and solve her own problems. How fantastic to have a bunch of female characters who have agency and can do whatever they need to do to save their lives!

    And to imply that the bedroom scene was fan service… I mean, the double standard here is so transparent… Besides the OBVIOUS subtext about forgiveness/moving forward and the nod to Mt. Weather (how does anyone miss that??) the scene was there to show how personal the relationship between Clarke and Lexa is even if Clarke is still not ready to admit her feelings for Lexa. Notice how Lexa shows up without her Commander masks/gear, she is not afraid to be vulnerable around Clarke, who, on the other hand, is obviously warming up to the idea of forgiving Lexa. Lexa will wait for Clarke to be ready because “it takes as longs as it takes.”That’s how you build up a relationship!! It was a beautiful scene, a perfect example of how the dynamic between Clarke and Lexa works so well in all of its different layers.

  13. I think everyone’s said exactly how I feel about the Bellamy segment of this discussion but I wanted to elaborate more on the Clarke/Lexa interaction. I don’t ship either Clarke/Lexa or Clarke/Bellamy (my favorite interactions come from those two, plus Clarke/Raven and Clarke/Abby) but to say the Clarke/Lexa scene was fanservice is in my opinion ridiculous and a biased comment easy to make if you don’t “ship” them. That scene was absolutely layered with emotion. Alycia Debnam Carey and Eliza Taylor played it with excellent subtlety. I think Clarke and Lexa will likely develop something romantic this season and that scene was a big indicator of why. When Clarke fails to understand how Lexa can move forwards after ALL her ambassadors betraying her, Lexa says she understands because the ambassadors did what they thought was best for her people – just like Lexa did, in episode 15 of season 2. That’s when it clicks for Clarke, and she can’t say anymore. She gets it. She’s always done what’s best for her people too. Lexa will always, always do what’s best for her people as well – and now Clarke is one of “her people” – they can work together. Another important moment is when they address each other: Clarke to Lexa in Trigedasleng, and Lexa to Clarke in English. They use their titles. Clarke addresses Lexa professionally, as ‘heda’, to show her respect and finally her understanding of her position and duty as ‘heda’. Lexa addresses her as ‘ambassador’. Not ‘wanheda’. Not ‘Clarke’. Not ‘princess’ (ew. Clarke Griffin doesn’t need saving). It’s a gentle scene and they bade goodnight. Absolutely necessary in terms of these two slowly, slowly, reconciling. You’d all complain if it was rushed and done in an episode, wouldn’t you?

    (Which is very much my complaint with Bellamy’s actions – in the first scene he nearly cries on Kane because he couldnt “save lives”. At the end of the same episode he is willing to kill 300 grounders, knowing Indra is among them; he’s worked with Indra before, he’s got Octavia and Kane begging him not to do this, and he still goes and does it. Whatever factors into next week’s massacre, because we don’t know the full image yet – Bellamy and Pike might not carry it out – the fact that Bellamy and Pike are willing to massacre a group because of their affiliation stinks of racial intolerance and xenophobia).

    I’d also agree with Katie Morris and request we get some replies/acknowledgements/explanations for this roundtable? With the seemingly unanimous exceptions of McKenzie Morrell and Nicola Choi but what exactly is your justification for the above two points about Clarke/Lexa, and also Bellamy and Pike? Or answer anybody else who’s criticized those points too.

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